3rd March 2008
Notes from the Greatham Parish Council meeting
As per my previous notes from Parish Council meetings, I would like to make it clear that these are not the official minutes of the Parish Council meeting, just my unofficial notes and comments. If you would like to read the office minutes of the Parish Council meeting, you will have to wait until after the next Parish Council meeting, when they will have been approved and (hopefully) submitted to me for inclusion on this website.
This evening's meeting started at 7.30pm, but was not opened by Councillor Buckland, but by the locum clerk, Chris Youngs. In attendance were Councillors Diane Buckland, Martin Chennell, Elwyn Evans, Ray Flack and David Rudd.
1. Position of Chairman – Locum Clerk to report
The clerk informed the council that, at the previous Parish Council meeting, a member of the public (not named by the clerk, but it was Don Jerrard) had asked for confirmation that Councillor Buckland had signed the Declaration of Acceptance of office when she had been elected as the Chairman of the Parish Council. The clerk informed the council that this was a legal obligation, but had been overlooked. As such, he asked Councillor Buckland to step down the the position of Chairman, and asked for the Vice Chairman, Councillor Chennell, to take over running the meeting.
Councillor Chennell immediately called for the election of Chairman. Councillor Buckland was proposed, seconded and elected. After correctly signing the Declaration of Acceptance of office, Councillor Buckland resumed her position as Chairman of the meeting.
2. Chairman’s Announcements
The chairman gave thanks to all members of the public for their support in getting the western wield back within the proposed South Downs National Park.
3. To receive apologies for absence
Apologies for absence were received from Councillors Alan Bridgman and Judy Onslow, and County Councillor Michael Cartwright.
4. To receive and record Declarations of Interest
None were received, although Councillor Rudd reminded the council that he was a trustee of the Village Hall.
5. Public Question time
The Locum clerk circulated a copy of a report that he had written about public question time, which stated that :
Over the past two meetings residents in public question time have made lengthy public statements which are inappropriate for public question time. The Council does not have a policy on the procedure of public question time and consequently to make it clear to the public and enable more questions to be asked, the following is suggested.
a) Any elector within the parish may put a question to the meeting about a matter for which the Council has a responsibility or which affects the parish;
b) An elector seeking a response to a question at the meeting must give the clerk notice of the question at least 5 clear days before the meeting;
c) Questions will not be received by the Council which are in furtherance of a person's individual circumstances or which are about a matter where there is a right of appeal to the courts, a tribunal or government minister;
d) A question will not be received by the Council where the issue it concerns has been the subject of a decision of the Council in the last 6 months;
e) An elector putting a question may speak for no more than one minute;
f) A maximum of 15 minutes will be allowed for public questions;
g) No discussion shall take place on any question put. Where practical, the Chairman may respond to the question or indicate that a written response will be made; and
h) Where notice of a question has been given, a reply may be given orally at the meeting by the Chairman or person nominated by the Chair, or a written reply given to the elector.If the above is agreed or indeed any amendments made, it would be inappropriate to implement b) at this meeting.
Whatever is agreed by the Council, it is further proposed that this be included in standing orders when they are next reviewed.
Councillor Buckland advised the council that she had no objections to what the locum clerk had suggested, although Councillor Bridgman had strongly objected, but Councillor Onslow agreed with the proposals. Councillor Buckland therefore proposed acceptance of the changes, seconded by Councillor Evans and they were agreed.
The formal notice of the change to Public Question Time can be viewed by clicking here.
6. To suspend Standing Orders for 15 minutes (if appropriate) for Public question time
Councillor Buckland proposed the that Council suspend standing orders for 15 minutes, which was agreed. Councillor Buckland then opened the meeting to the floor and asked for questions, not statements.
Mr Booton asked the Chairman why there had been the changes the public questions. Councillor Buckland said that it was in response to a number of complaints from members of the public who had not been able to questions as other members of the public were making lengthy statements. Mr Booton why this had not been a problem in the past? Councillor Buckland replied that she did not know. Mr Booton left the meeting.
Miss Simmons asked whether there would be monitoring of the number of questions raised in line with the new rules and whether, if it was proved to be mot as effective, would the Parish Council return to the current method? Councillor Buckland responded that the council was looking for questions to be made from the public, not statements, and the council would see whether the new rules were an effective solution to the problem.
Mrs Jerrard asked the Chairman why Councillor Chennell had not declared that he had been made bankrupt whilst he was a Parish Councillor? Councillor Buckland replied that she was not going to answer questions from specific allegations. Mrs Jerrard stated that Councillor Chennell had acted illegally by remaining as a Councillor whilst bankrupt and he should have resigned. The clerk stated that the question raised by Mrs Jerrard was covered by (c) in the proposals, in that it was a furtherance of a person's individual circumstance or about a matter where there is a right of appeal to the courts, a tribunal or government minister.
Mr Jerrard asked why the clerk had not read out the comments from the absent councillors in full. The chairman replied that she had said that Councillor Bridgman opposed the changes strongly. Mr Jerrard said that he had not heard because the microphone was not being used.
Mrs Cheesman said that the minutes of the 4th September stated that the Greatham Parish Council would be adopting the HMRC payroll cleansing service, but there was no mention that Greatham Parish Council would be ignoring the need to pay PAYE for locum clerks. The Chairman replied that she did not have the letter from HMRC with her, but Mrs Cheesman said that all the comments were in the one letter from HMRC and offered Councillor Buckland a copy. Councillor Buckland responded that all the actions from HMRC had been dealt with and that they have put into place the payroll cleansing service. Mrs Cheesman disputed this, citing that the locum clerk was not paying PAYE. Councillor Buckland said this was because the locum clerk was self-employed. Councillor Buckland said that Mr Youngs had confirmed this to her, but Mrs Cheesman said that Councillor Buckland should have taken advice from HMRC. Councillor Buckland said that she did not need to ask HRC as Mr Youngs had confirmed he was self-employed. Councillor Buckland asked Mr Youngs to confirm this in writing to her.
Mr Lewis asked the Chairman why it was so difficult to get information from Greatham Parish Council under the Freedom of Information Act. He asked whether there was something that the council was trying to hide? Councillor Buckland responded that the council was not trying to hide anything. Mr Lewis said that he had asked for information, but Mr Youngs had not replied.
At this point, Councillor Evans said, "Why don't you shut up, Roger. You come in here blabbering and rabbiting..." Councillor Buckland tried, in vain, to silence Councillor Evans. Mr Lewis said, to the Chairman, "We've come to expect this ..." to which Councillor Evans replied, "We've come to expect you more like."
The clerk advised Mr Lewis that he had dealt with all the requests that had been made of him, but there was some information that was excluded under the FOIA and he would not be supplying that. He said that he had answered all requests that had come from Mr. Lewis, but suggested that Mr Lewis had asked the Chairman for information, but that he ought to make all requests to the clerk who will consider them.
Mr Lewis asked the Chairman why he, as a member of the public, was subject to abuse from one of the Councillors. Councillor Evans replied, "I didn't abuse you, Roger. I told you to shut up. People can't ask questions will you rabbiting on." Mr Lewis stated that he was addressing the Chairman, not Councillor Evans, but Councillor Evans said that standing orders had been suspended and so he could say what he liked.
Miss Simmons asked whether the council had received any plans for the land adjacent to the top of Longmoor Road. Councillor Buckland said that no plans had been received. Councillor Evans pointed out that the land being cleared was a bridleway.
There being no further questions, standing orders were reinstated.
7. To approve as a correct record and authorise the signing of the minutes of the meeting of the Greatham Parish Council held on 4th February 2008
These were approved with no comments. These minutes can be seen on this website by clicking here.
8. To approve as a correct record and authorise the signing of the minutes of the meeting of the Greatham Parish Council held on 19th June 2007.
9. To approve as a correct record and authorise the signing of the minutes of the meeting of the Greatham Parish Council held on 31st July 2007.
Councillor Buckland stated that the minutes of the meetings on 19th June 2007 and 31st July 2007 had not been approved, but said that the agenda items would have to be deferred as she had forgotten to circulate these minutes to councillors.
10. Reports from County and District Councillors
Councillor Buckland said that no report had been received from either County Councillor Michael Cartwright or District Councillor Judy Onslow.
11. Financial Matters
a) Approval of payments
The first payment was introduced by the Chairman, as being the clerk's salary. Councillor Buckland said Councillor Bridgman had agreed to this as RFO. The payment was agreed, although no mention was made as to how much it was for. Councillor Buckland also said that Councillor Bridgman had said there was a need to transfer from money as there were invoices to be coming for grass-cutting and £185 to the NALC. Councillor Bridgman had proposed that £1,000 be transferred from the Reserve Account to the Current Account to cover these cheques.
b) Confirmation of budget
The clerk had circulated a budget statement to all councillors for 2008/9, which was as follows :
The precept was agreed at the January meeting but the budget was not finalised, as some amendments needed to be made to the proposal that was discussed. Also one of the actions agreed at the last meeting was as follows: "The Locum Clerk at the next meeting should draw up a budget for spending the precept in 2008/9, such that this can be monitored during the next financial year."
Item Suggested budget 2008/09 Receipts - Bank interest 500 Payments Clerk's exp 4200 Admin 4580 Maintenance/play 2455 grants 1265 Projects 0 Total payments 12500 Net Expenditure 12000 Precept 12000 It was agreed at the January Council meeting, that project funding such as any grant to the Village Hall and the playground drainage should come from the Council's reserves.
The Chairman said that there was nothing to be discussed, and that this was just clarifying the budget approved for 2008/9, but it needed to be formally approved. This was agreed by all.
By contrast, the budget for 2007/8 can be viewed by clicking here - it is interesting to compare the level of detail applied to the budgeting of public expenditure between the previous Parish Council and the present parish council.
c) Bank reconciliation
The clerk reported that the Parish Council held the following balanced in each bank account :
| Reserve Account |
£30,864.32
|
| Old Church Account |
£10,970.23
|
| Current Account |
£303.91
|
The clerk explained that these balances were prior to the previously agreed transfer of £1,000 taking place.
d) Verbal report by Responsible Financial Officer, Cllr Bridgman on update of actions agreed at last meeting
Councillor Bridgman being absent, and statement from him was read out stating that he was pleased to report that all items were receiving attention, although the NatWest Bank were proving to be an obstacle, but that he hoped to have these issues resolved by April 2008.
12. Correspondence received
a) Hampshire Association of Local Councils
b) Greatham Village Hall Trustees
The letter from the Greatham Village Hall trustees stated that they were in communication with Guy Ritchie at EHDC with regards to a community grant, and asked that Greatham Parish Council be patient, but once the building regulations had been approved, the village hall trustees would be able to ask for quotes.
c) Consultation on East Hampshire’s new Community Strategy and EHDC’s Core strategy as part of the Local Development Framework
d) South Downs Campaign
e) E mails from residents to Locum Clerk
The clerk reported that he had received many requests for information under the Freedom of Information Act, and that he was presently spend in the region of 7 hours per week keeping up with the correspondence. He explained to the public that some of the requests take time to gather information in response to, but he is trying to do as best as he can.
f) 101 Stakeholder update
g) Audit Commission
The clerk reported that every councillor has a copy of the latest letter from the Audit Commission, and that he is planning to respond to the letter, in part, this week, but there was some digging required to establish the full facts.
13. Village Website & Parish Council
The clerk distributed a report which stated :
At the last meeting during public question time a question was asked about putting reports on the website. It was responded that this was a grey area as the Council had no policy regarding what goes on the website and it was suggested that the Locum Clerk prepares a report considering this at this meeting.
The website is an important vehicle to communicate with the 'outside world'. However it is not in the direct control of the Council, so some ground rules should be agreed by the Council which are suggested as follows.
1. To keep the main page up to date. This includes general information on the council, its responsibilities, general planning information and funding.
2. Keep the second page up to date with details of Councillors and the Clerk. Members may wish to comment on what Cllr details as a minimum are required.
3. Keep the third page up to date with details of meetings and minutes.
4. The forth page contains planning decisions from EHDC and this has not been updated since June 2006 and nobody seems to have questioned this. It is therefore suggested, that as the information is kept on the EHDC website, there is no need to have this page and it should be deleted. The Council publishes planning agendas and minutes and these should be included on the website.
5. Keep the fifth page up to date with details on the playground. This needs changing, as it refers to the Playground sub committee which no longer exists.
6. Keep the sixth page up to date with financial matters. This also needs updating.
7. The Chairman and or Clerk submit statements informing residents of current activities and or important information.
8. Members or clerk's reports to Council meetings should be included on the website.
9. The Clerk and or Chairman keep the website up to date together with any other additions/changes agreed by Council
Councillor Bridgman's comments were reported that he felt that the website was a most useful asset to the village, and that he would like to keep all the planning applications on the website, but no planning applications had been passed to the webmaster.
Councillor Flack said that the Parish Council has no control over the website. The clerk pointed out that the council do control what goes on. Councillor Rudd said that the planning part of the website should be updated, and Councillor Flack said that it needs some minutes and agendas that are missing. Councillor Buckland suggested that planning decisions should be passed to Paul Larner for inclusion on the website.
14. Frequency of meetings
Councillor Bridgman's comments were reported that he saw no point in changing the present system. He said that the public needed the opportunity to discuss matters with the Parish Council on a monthly basis and he saw no need to change the frequency of meetings. Councillor Buckland asked whether it was necessary to have a meeting every month, and Councillor Flack suggested one meeting every 6 weeks might be better. He said that the planning committee meets when there are planning applications received. Councillor Rudd also agreed that meetings could be reduced to one every 6 weeks. Councillor Evans said that he saw no problems with meeting once every 6 weeks.
Councillor Chennell asked what the clerk's experience was of other councils. The clerk replied that councils vary. He said that Greatham Parish Council approve everything that comes through. He said that there was a need to review regular payments, as they usually have 30 day payment terms. He suggested that he meet up with the RFO to identify regular payments and discuss these at the next meeting. If it was approved, he would schedule the meetings for a 6-weekly basis.
Councillor Buckland suggested the matter be discussed at the next meeting. Councillor Rudd pointed out that they would need to check when the village hall was available.
15. To review Planning matters
Councillor Chennell said that planning matters were to be discussed at the next planning meeting. He said that an agenda would be issued tomorrow.
16. To receive the Playground Report
The clerk reported that a request to have the zip wire and seat replaced had been made to Hand Made Places. He said that Hand Made Places will try to fit the parts for the Easter weekend. The clerk also reported that he was in contact with two organisations with regards to the drainage. he said that he was awaiting quotes, which he would present back to the council.
17. To receive a Highways and Transport Report
Councillor Chennell said that he had nothing to report. Councillor Flack pointed out that the build-out had still not been fixed. Councillor Chennell said that HCC was waiting for the motorist's insurance company to agree to pay for the damage.
18. To receive a Footpath Report
The clerk said that there was nothing to report from Councillor Bridgman.
19. Old Church Update
Funding is still being sought
20. To confirm the date of the next meeting
This was confirmed as being on the 7th April 2008.
The chairman closed the meeting at 8.30pm.
Like previous articles, the above article is based on my notes from the meeting and should not be considered as the official minutes of the meeting which will be posted on this website after they have been agreed at the next Parish Council meeting. If any other attendees at the meeting believe that I have misreported any events from the meeting, I would be grateful for their comments and will be happy to put the record straight.
Paul Larner